UYGUR: All right. Now, next, the Tea Party is frothing at the mouth trying to shut the government down. Will Boehner do their bidding, or will they take them out? We`re going to talk to one of the Tea Party leaders and ask him what he wants to on do with Boehner if he won`t shut down the government.
And we`re going to break down Paul Ryan`s con job on the country. Could the so-called cuts actually make the budget mess even worse? And what`s his real goal if it isn`t to balance the budget?
UYGUR: Up next, the Tea Party is gunning for a government shutdown unless all its demands are met. But what will the group do if Speaker Boehner makes a deal with Democrats? Well, we`re going to ask a Tea Party leader. He`s right here and he`s going to weigh in, next.
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REP. STENY HOYER (D), MINORITY WHIP: The Tea Party on your side, as so often is the case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Speaker, re-claim me my time.
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UYGUR: Republicans so touchy about the Tea Party that they literally shut down Democratic whip Steny Hoyer when he dared to criticize the movement on the House floor.
The Tea Party and its unwillingness to compromise is why a shutdown is still on the table. And a new NBC/”Wall Street Journal” poll points to who is unwilling to give an inch in this debate. The numbers are very telling. It finds that 68 percent of Democrats think their leaders should be willing to make compromise, to give consensus to the current spending debate, and they`ve gotten their wish. They have compromised and compromised.
But look at what happens when you ask Republicans — only 38 percent think that their party leaders should compromise in order to make a deal. And that number drops again when you ask Tea Party members. Just 28 percent, less than three in 10, think that GOP leaders should make concessions.
The Tea Party`s unwillingness to give even an inch was on full display at a rally yesterday organized by Americans for Prosperity. Here is Indiana Congressman Mike Pence calling for a shutdown if the group can`t get its way.
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REP. MIKE PENCE (R), INDIANA: If liberals in the Senate would rather force a government shutdown instead of accepting a modest downpayment on fiscal discipline and reform — I say, shut it down.
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UYGUR: Well, their position seems to be clear. They don`t want any compromise, and they`re literally chanting shut it down. Hey, when you can`t get your way, just shut it down, right?
By the way, who does that remind you of? For me, it reminds me of the kid who would take their ball and go home if it didn`t go their way. You remember that kid? You guys can`t call me out, I was safe. I`m going home and having a Tea Party.
With me now is Judson Phillips, founder of the Tea Party Nation.
All right. Judson, you see my position on this. So, let me ask you, do you want to you`re your ball and go home?
JUDSON PHILLIPS, TEA PARTY NATION: No, actually, I`d love to see 545 people up in Washington act like grownups and realize we`ve got a major spending and debt problem and start doing serious reductions before we have an economic catastrophe.
UYGUR: Now, when grownups negotiate and I`ve been involved in negotiations. You probably as well, Judson, they see usually come to some of the sort of compromise. If one side says I`m just going to hold my breath until I turn blue, until you get what you want, that doesn`t lead to a compromise or to a solution, does it?
PHILLIPS: And that sounds like Harry Reid who has said –
UYGUR: Really? How so?
PHILLIPS: Yes, Harry Reid said he would not consider senior anything that the GOP sent over. I mean, how many times did he say, you know, it`s not going to be more than $33 billion, not include any riders.
UYGUR: No, Judson, you know that`s not true.
PHILLIPS: Yes, it is. It`s been on the news, even on MSNBC.
UYGUR: Hold on, everybody agrees that the Democrats are conceding to $33 billions. In fact, I`ve heard now $34.5 billion, right? Are you saying they`re not conceding to that? Because that`s what every single person is reporting.
PHILLIPS: No, I think that is figure that they have gone with.
UYGUR: OK. So, they are willing to make a deal, they`ll shake on it right now?
PHILLIPS: Right. Here`s the problem — we have $1,600 billion as a deficit for this year, $1.65 trillion, all right? And the amount that the Democrats are talking about cutting is a mere $33 billion. That`s 2 percent. Boehner is talking about doing a little bit more, not a whole lot, but a little more.
UYGUR: So, it appears you`re saying it`s merely enough. You don`t want him to compromise. That`s what I got — that seems to be clear.
So, let me play you a video of John Boehner. He was asked about if there`s any difference between you guys and him. It`s interesting. Let`s watch.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know what the Democrats say? They say they could cut a deal with you, but you won`t buck the Tea Party.
REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R-OH), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: There`s no daylight between the Tea Party and me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: None?
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UYGUR: Is that true?
PHILLIPS: Oh, I wish. Now, he — I mean, you know, Boehner is improving a bit, so I`m going to give credit. He is improving a bit. But Boehner is not where any of us in the Tea Party want him to be.
You know, I penned an open letter to Boehner this afternoon, saying, look, the General Accounting Office has pointed hundreds of billions of dollars that can be eliminated in the budget just by eliminating inefficient programs, programs that don`t work, programs that are duplicated. Hey, let`s start there.
Nobody supports wasteful and fraudulent government spending. Everybody would agree, hey, if the money is being wasted, we need to cut it out. So, let`s start there. So, I mean, that`s where I kind of like him to start.
UYGUR: All right. So, let me get this right. If the Democrats concede again and you get to $35 billion, are you still in favor of shutting it down?
PHILLIPS: No, I`m in favor of real substantial budget cuts.
UYGUR: OK. In other words, if they say $35 billion, no — no deal, shut it down.
PHILLIPS: That`s — I mean, $34 billion, 35 billion, which you`re talking deficits the size we`re talking about, that`s a joke.
UYGUR: But Judson, everybody watching right now thinks we can`t ever get a deal with you. I mean , we went to 40, you still say no, 45 — I mean, at what point do you say yes unless you get everything you want?
PHILLIPS: Well –
UYGUR: Give me a number. What`s the number where you say, all right, fine, OK, let`s have a deal?
PHILLIPS: I would go, personally, this is me. If they came up with $100 billion, I wouldn`t be happy, but I`d say, OK, I can compromise on that.
UYGUR: Wait, $100 billion — you mean like $61, that`s what the Republicans asked for? You mean beyond that 100?
PHILLIPS: No, I`m talking about — let`s go with the original $100 billion that the Republican said they were going to cut, and the GAO has given them a blueprint. You can cut hundreds of billions just on waste.
UYGUR: So, beyond 100 percent — you want beyond 100 percent of what the Republicans are asking for right now?
PHILLIPS: Hey, Cenk, this is not at game where we go, oh, well, we`re going to negotiate and we`ll see who goes first and we play monopoly.
UYGUR: No, it`s not a game, Judson.
PHILLIPS: We have a lot of debt.
UYGUR: You know what happens? Our troops don`t get paid. It`s not a game to them.
UYGUR: I mean, we`re risking their lives in Iraq and Afghanistan and you are willing to shut down the government unless you get over 100 percent of what you want and so, then, these guys aren`t getting paid even though they`re risking their lives. That doesn`t sound like a game to me, either. I mean, you`re willing to do that?
PHILLIPS: The GOP offered a bill that would make sure –
UYGUR: Oh, come on, Judson. Come on.
UYGUR: You`re saying ultimately — ultimately you will say no to all deals. It`s a gimmick for a week.
PHILLIPS: — so all these guys will get paid.
UYGUR: No, no, that`s a gimmick for a week. Ultimately, you`re saying the final deal, you won`t have under any circumstances.
Do you — last thing for you, Judson, here`s the thing I can`t understand about you guys. You act like you`re the only people in the country, like the Tea Party somehow is the president and the Congress and everybody else and the Supreme Court. You know there are other people in the country and those people are saying compromise. So — and think about that, what does it do to your own party, when you force them into an untenable situation, and then you got general electorate saying we don`t want that? Doesn`t that even — doesn`t that hurt your own party?
PHILLIPS: You`re assuming facts not in evidence. The majority of American people have said we want the spending –
UYGUR: But they say when you want a deal, they say yes.
PHILLIPS: They would prefer have the government shut down –
UYGUR: That is not what the polls say.
PHILLIPS: It is.
UYGUR: The American people do not want the government shutdown. That is not remotely true.
PHILLIPS: Yes, it is. It most certainly is.
UYGUR: OK. All right. Well, we`ll show the polls. We`ll show the polls. OK?
PHILLIPS: Fair enough.
UYGUR: Judson Phillips, thank you for your time tonight. You made things more clear.
PHILLIPS: Thank you for the invitation.
UYGUR: We appreciate it.
PHILLIPS: Thank you.